Who says APHC is irrelevant?

Where red hot blood of youth, ashes of residential houses, more painfully the lost honour ----- be represented by a forum like APHC in Kashmir, no change however big in situation can marginalize such forums or render them irrelevant. Kashmiris are caught up in a dangerously conflicting situation. But look at their political valour, they are facing it manfully. This is like dancing in the mouth of a lion, with such a style not letting to be swallowed by the beast, however, while crying in the process, the cries should be heard and while smiling, the smile should be understood. To smile with derision is never pleasing. The smile with derision conveys what it does---------anger, alienation and turmoil. Therefore, while analyzing the given situation let thinkers in India and Pakistan not falter and not make wrong predictions without taking into consideration the collective Psychological behaviour of the people of Kashmir.” The senior liberation leader and the former Chairman of All Parties Hurriyat Conference, Prof Abdul Ghani Bhat in his exclusive interview with Nisar Ahmed Thakur.How do you see the developments taking place in the region with reference to Kashmir?In view of the turbulent history of the subcontinent one should admit this harsh reality that Kashmir is an internationally recognised dispute that pushed India and Pakistan to wars. Kashmir is a dispute that bedevils relations between the two countries. Kashmir as a consequence of nuclear weaponization of India and Pakistan has assumed monstrous dimensions; it is a nuclear flash point. If we choose to ensure peace in the entire South Asia region we will have to address Kashmir, therefore any development in Kashmir, around Kashmir or about Kashmir will have to be viewed in a perspective, a perspective which is rooted in political history of the subcontinent.Despite the APHC’s call for boycott people in Kashmir participated in the recent Assembly elections. What do you say about it is it that the people have lost their faith in APHC?When I discuss Kashmir with reference to elections I take a position which is that no electoral process whatsoever has any direct or indirect bearing on the future dispensation of the dispute on Jammu and Kashmir. The UN Security Council in this regard adopted a resolution declaring that no electoral process in Kashmir will in any case affect the nature of the dispute as well as the future dispensation.So for as the electoral process is concerned you see anywhere in the world elections are always held with a view to set up an administration to govern the people in order to provide them orderly life. This usually lasts for 5 years and then you repeat the exercise so as to give the people a chance to elect the representatives of their own choice.Whereas to determine future of a region or people, if and when it is disputed, you don’t hold elections, you hold a plebiscite and a plebiscite is organized once the entire life of a nation, unlike the electoral process you don’t need to repeat the exercise after every five years. Therefore, you have to draw a line between elections and a referendum. So let it be clear that plebiscite is organized in a region wherein the peoples’ aspirations are required to be ascertained.Hurriyat in Kashmir stands for a plebiscite not for the elections. Therefore when you discuss Kashmir as a dispute with reference to the electoral process, well I am not upset about any election process, I am not upset by any type of results, I am not upset by any style of the voting by the people be it be brisk or be it just sluggish. I don’t bother my head about it.Electoral process any where in the world has to be viewed with reference to the grievances and the problems of the people. So the governments or local administrations are installed to solve the problems facing the people in any country. However, no government can claim to be the final arbiter of the future of a state, no not at all; the final arbiters are the people. Well in Kashmir the administration is not the final arbiter with reference to future dispensation, it is the people of Kashmir who are the architects of their destiny.Even the voters in Jammu and Kashmir have made it abundantly clear that they vote neither for India nor Pakistan, they vote neither for anybody nor against anybody rather they voted for the problems. They voted just to ensure that their problems and grievances are addressed. So therefore while discussing Kashmir let us not mix-up the future dispensation with electoral process.Hurriyat had taken a position earlier on that elections constitute no issue for us and I explain for obvious reasons as for as the future dispensation is concerned election is not the answer and it has never been the answer. India and Pakistan fought wars in spite of elections; no elections could produce a result with reference to the final settlement of Kashmir. I think we will have to address the root cause in Kashmir, if we really mean to ensure peace, not peace of the graveyard but peace at heart, peace at home, once we choose to do it I am sure that we will be able to ensure a brighter future and a better region for the people in South Asia.In view of the political changes sweeping across the globe what steps do you suggest to make APHC a vibrant political forum?Competence and honesty are the virtues of leadership. Where competence and honesty guides the leadership no hiccups can cause its death, where incompetence and dishonesty be the method of dealing with a particular situation you can visualize the consequences. Yes, the ineptness and the lack of sanity will in every case lead to failures. So for as the APHC as a forum is concerned there needs a lot of thinking, APHC will have to consider different issues no doubt about it, they will have to discuss the situation with reference to India-Pakistan as well as global changes, every thing has to be taken into consideration. The dynamics of the change will have to be taken into consideration let me tell you if we lose sight of the changes sweeping across we may be swept away by the winds of change. We will have to devise a strategy to ride the tide of change; if we don’t do it I am afraid the change may swallow us deep down. So the members of the APHC in Kashmir will have to do a lot of thinking in hammering out a strategy to deal with the challenges ahead. Well failures are the pillars of success. But you only need the courage to admit and then correct your misdeeds. This will ensure success in any circumstances. So it is very important that people shouldn’t now in any case ride a blind horse.What about restructuring of APHC?We have to have a constitution, although we have a constitution no doubt about it, but I feel that we need amendment in the constitution that will enable us to effectively workout a strategy to deal with any situation. If the constitution be somewhat hazy with reference to certain issues, certain pressing issues, we will probably never be able to deal with any situation therefore my first suggestion to APHC would be that the constitution of the APHC is amended to suit the genius of the people as well as address the current issues effectively. Restructuring is the stepping stone rather a launching pad for Hurriyat to restart political life as a whole.As an intellectual what do you think about the institutionalization of Hurriyat?Institutionalization of Hurriyat is an essential part of our collective forum, because we will have to build institutions not only to sustain the movement but also giving people some thing to think about, some thing to live with and something to live for. That is very important and I don’t want to go into the further details………We will have to produce ideas with reference to the solution of Kashmir. We need people who can provide us with ideas to deal with the situation, who can occasionally float some outlines of future solution of Kashmir. We need such institution that is one aspect of it but let it be clear that we don’t need to dismiss Hurriyat as just a bunch of people with no ideas, this is not fair but at the same time it does not mean we are all Platos of our times and none other than us will have the mandate to talk and mandate to deliver.However, we are a forum that represents the peoples’ aspirations. We need to explain to the people elsewhere that this forum represents the ashes of the houses, the last honour of our mothers, sisters and daughters. Where the investment be blood, ashes and the lost honour such political forums can never be marginalized. Whatever the situation they may experience hiccups I confess, they may commit mistakes, they may probably not be able to cope with any situation and they may sometimes fall prey to emotionalism and cause problems to be faced by entire people in the state that is true, I do admit but this is an undeniable fact that the Hurriyat represents the investment that is huge and which in terms of politics can never ever be ignored, impossible…Therefore Hurriyat people will have to proceed not only with constitutional restructuring, institutionalization but also with deeper understanding of the problems facing us as a whole. For that you need think tanks to develop links with Hurriyat and with the people and probably with the future as well if that happens I am sure that we will be able to deliver.Other than the APHC there are some political forces in Kashmir who are talking of a durable and final settlement of Kashmir dispute. What do you think about having relationship with such forces?Well, we will have to have a working relationship with all such political parties in Jammu and Kashmir who by one way or the other seek permanent settlement of Kashmir dispute.Kashmir belongs to all. We will have to move together, the togetherness I talk about will give us not only courage but wisdom too, to build a secure future for the next generation in Kashmir and in South Asia as well. This is how I look at it.As a relevant political forum, how would the APHC prove its strength as cynics in Indian media say that the forum has lost support of the masses in Kashmir?I think Indians falter in analysing any given situation, so also may be probably the case in Pakistan. In certain quarters that they falter and they do not consider Kashmir in a proper historical, political and psychological prospective. If you don’t do it you will never be able to analyze a given situation scientifically and objectively. And in my opinion while discussing Kashmir issue you will have to understand Kashmiris with reference to history.My history as a Kashmiri is chequered, I had to grow under tyranny, I had to bear with oppression but my beauty lies not so much in mountains or the flowing rivers or gardens the Mughals made. No……my beauty lies in bearing the burden of sanity and that is a big thing wherefore I live as a community and I live as Kashmiri, otherwise, look at the people who invaded us, look at them they would have finished us …But we never could be finished this is because we understand the art of living, we know how to bear the burden of sanity. One more important feature of our collective personality is that in a conflicting situation we choose to adjust, this adjustability is unfortunately misconstrued either as normalcy or a surrender both are incorrect.Those who ignore the history of Kashmir and the Kashmiris should bear in mind that people of Kashmir have not given up their cause. I want to remind them just a couple of months back there was just a spark, which engulfed the entire state. The issue of Shrine Board….what happened, it was a department to department issue, a trivial issue but look at it when people got an opportunity they rose, rose as one politically homogeneous unit, they did not demand any thing else but raised a slogan “we want freedom”…this was a ladder which we used to reach the ultimate destination. And let the cynics, wherever they be, appreciate the dynamics of Kashmiris’ political strategy. They strike and strike harder when it gets hot and if they don’t feel, blame shall lie with them.Destination! What do you mean?The destination is permanent settlement of the dispute of Kashmir; it is in the permanent settlement of the dispute of Kashmir that you will not only ensure peace but also purposeful progress, the progress for each region that is again very important. And when Kashmiris say we seek a permanent settlement of the dispute they are at the same time introducing an element of flexibility into it that is there are people in some parts of Jammu and Ladakh who don’t want to go with you, you can not ignore them. So you have to go together, move together and when you talk in terms of Jammu, Ladakh, Kashmir and Azad Kashmir you need a large heart.In your opinion what is the way forward to seek a workable solution of Kashmir dispute?You have to be imaginative and pragmatic you can’t live in a vacuum, impossible, you can’t draw lines on running water, no pictures can come up when you recognize the sombre political realities that yes considering contradictions in Jammu and Kashmir you have to introduce an element of flexibility into your attitudes and your approach towards the problem that will facilitate the resolution of Kashmir problem if that does not happen I am afraid we may land ourselves in a huge trouble and that should be avoided. I think when we say the permanent settlement of Kashmir we mean that we will never ever ignore the people living in the parts of Jammu and Ladakh. Even we can not ignore India and Pakistan at any cost because both the nations are deeply involved in Kashmir.India and Pakistan are two sovereign states, I represent the dispute in Kashmir, I don’t represent the state as such, I am not sovereign, and my sovereignty is in dispute when Kashmir is in dispute, everything is in dispute, the peace of land is in dispute, the grip of India is in dispute. I don’t go into the semantics of words I am talking in terms of the sombre political realities we will therefore have to understand that it is through a dialogue, a purposeful, comprehensive and productive dialogue that we can ensure a brighter tomorrow better region for the generations to come.Considering nuclear weaponization, the open market economy, the Chinese and American involvement in South Asia, considering all this we have to work together with sanity and pragmatism to achieve a breakthrough to resolve the dispute of Kashmir amicably. To seek a settlement, Kashmiris have to be content with two conflicting situations (a) we have to live, if we don’t live we need no freedom, we need freedom for the people who live not for the dead (b) we never ignore the sentiment we never accept the political hegemony, India and Pakistan will have to accept this reality, well for that matter Kashmiris don’t want to ride rough shot on anybody they don’t allow any other to ride rough shot on them that is the principle therefore while addressing in a given situation, the forces operating in the conflicting zone must not misconstrue this adjustability of Kashmiris as normalcy or as an improvement in the situation. This is absolutely wrong, that is why I say while analyzing the Indians falter and probably Pakistanis too in many cases.How can APHC prove its strength on ground as well as on the international level?My strength doesn’t lie in ballot papers; my strength doesn’t lie in holding huge rallies, my strength lies in the sentiment, rooted deep down into the hearts and minds of the people in Kashmir. My strength lies in the realization in Europe and America that unless we address the root cause, we can never fight violence. Well how do we do it? We are proceeding towards what we have been preaching over the years that is the entire world realizes that unless the root in Kashmir is addressed no arrangement can work, no arrangement whether it be between India and Pakistan, whether it be between Pakistan and Kashmiris, between Indians and Kashmiris it is not going to yield any positive results. I know trilateral dialogue is probably not workable at the moment but a trilateral arrangement in any case is workable wherein Kashmiris should be taken into confidence. Unless they do it I am afraid we will not be able to make any headway.This is what is shaping up, shaping up not only in the subcontinent, but elsewhere in the world. You know just a couple of months back, people of Kashmir rose; they rose in such a fashion that produced music in terms of global politics there are the countries who asked India not to use force against peaceful protestors in Kashmir. Even Indian intellectuals came up with statements saying that it is in the interest of India that they free themselves from Kashmir, and Kashmiris free themselves from Indian. This was a huge statement, I don’t think we don’t have to worked hard but the need of the hour is to have a deeper sense of understanding and a lot of rethink on many issues which are probably, occasionally as trivial as any issues but these issues some times cause turmoil in our ranks therefore we have to be wakeful and not blind to. If competence and honesty not be the criteria, no miracles can happen.....Any message for the leadership of India and Pakistan?There has to be imaginative and pragmatic approach in New Delhi as well as in Islamabad towards the people of the subcontinent as a whole. What is that? That is the Indians and Pakistanis declare they are brothers, we are good neighbours, we have problems but we have the capacity to resolve these disputes in the larger interests of the people of the region for that matter you will have to resolve the dispute of Kashmir because Kashmir is the mother of all odds, if the mother is treated, health is restored I am sure that we will absolutely have no illness either in terms of relationship or in terms of our politico-psychological behaviour.