Elections in Kashmir - a Non-issue (By Professor Abdul Gani Butt)

Jammu and Kashmir as a disputed territory involves primarily the Peoples inalienable right to be the architects of their destiny. The denial of this right in contravention of internationally accepted principle has literally produced war like crisis in the entire Sub-continent. Every thing is gone--law, order, peace, security and ah: the dignity and honour too! In an environment where the very survival be the concern of each one of us the electoral process as an issue pales into insignificance .The debate whether a boycott is called or not is probably equally inconsequential for reasons never far to seek .The UN security council passed a resolution as far back as 50’s to the effect that no elections can either change the nature of the dispute or affect adversely the future dispensation of Jammu and Kashmir.
Jammu and Kashmir is never a homogeneous political entity .The contradictions in terms of geography, history, culture, language and even in terms of political aspirations demand that a sensible approach is adopted while dealing with any given situation in the region. Whether a boycott is called or not the voting happens. The people in Jammu division both Hindus and Muslims vote-Ladakh is no exception .This constitutes the half of the state. Look at Kashmir, the people in border areas under the shadow of soldier’s guns must vote. As far the planes, the pro-Indian political parties participate in the electoral process as a matter of policy and capture votes irrespective of the fact, whether the turnout is low or high. What should concern a political leader, representing the dispute, with his two eyes wide open that if he calls a boycott and voting happens, he lands himself , where? The situation being what it is, the voting happens ,boycott calls not- withstanding. Does he win or lose?The answer lies were it does . As a matter of fact he losses the battle .May I ask: did he win the battle or lost it in the last elections. I leave it to leaders with eyes wide open to come out. Where in a region with contradictions the voting is bound to happen, need the leaders call a boycott or declare the process as a non-issue and thus render the entire exercise inconsequential with reference to UN Security Council’s resolution. We need distinctly draw a line between elections and referendum. These are two different democratic methods – the former for governance and the later for dispensation .The elections happen after every five years and a referendum if and when organized will happens only once in a nation’s life time. He who mixes up , does no good to himself much less to the people he claims to represent .Elections , we call a non-issue for a simple reason that these exercises could neither in the past nor will in the future produce a result in terms of ‘resolution of the problem’ . May I ask yet another question that when voting happens in spite of boycott calls, who sells it at a huge premium this is the reason that we don’t want to use term “Boycott”. The term as a matter of strategy doesn’t go well with us . If you do the thinking you never run into trouble ;and if you don’t do it, God help you! We skip the term with a style to plead our case more effectively to the democrats around . We are not against elections as a democratic process but we never shall accept electoral process as a substitute for the peoples right to be the architects of their destiny . If elections could be an alternative , the wars wouldn’t have happened on Kashmir despite periodical elections .
We seek a settlement of Kashmir problem in the larger interests of a brighter future and a better world .Let us rise above –above yesterday, above hostility, above intransigence and the sub-continental irony ,and work out an acceptable ,honourable and a durable solution of Kashmir problem to the flutter of all hearts across the globe . Let us prefer to be human and leave fighting to the beasts.

Interview of Prof. Abdul Gani Bhat With Weekly Chattan (Urdu)

Terrorism in any form at any level horrific: Prof Bhat

Muslim Conference Supremo and Executive Member APHC Prof. Abdul Gani Bhat in a statement said that the terror attack in Lahore on Monday morning was more horrible in the sense that the terrorists got into a police academy were the cadets were engaged in a morning parade , however one can hardly resist feeling that the leadership in Delhi and Islamabad owe a duty to the people that a purposeful peace is restored and the future ensured for them in India and Pakistan . Prof. Bhat maintained that the attacks happen in both countries so let us summon up courage ,and address the root causes and prefer to be human and leave fighting beasts in the Jungle; would that we promote the togetherness and conjointly face the menace.

Death of Ghulam Muhammad Bhat is unforgettable loss to the nation : Muslim Conference

Chairman of Jammu Kashmir MusPeoples League, Mukhtar Ahmad Waza has expresses profound grief and sorrow over the sad demise of Ghulam Muhammad Bhat, who was suffering from cancer and left heavenly abode on Sunday. A delegation of pro-freedom leaders led by Prof. Abdul Gani Bhat along with Mukhtar Ahmad Waza, Bilal Gani Lone, Mohammad Yasin Malik, Fazl Haq Qurashi visited the house of Bhat and conveyed the condolences to the bereaved family. Later on the delegation paid a visit to martyrs graveyard at Eidgah and offered Fateh Khawani to all martyrs including Shaheed Hurriyat Mirwaiz Moulana Mohammad Farooq, Shaheed Abdul Gani Lone, Shaheed-e-Azeemat Sheikh Abdul Aziz, Shaheed Ishfaq Majeed and Shaheed S. Hameed Wani. The delegation said that they are committed to the oath and carry on the mission for which these martyrs have laid down their precious lives shall be carried till to the logical conclusion.

Death of Ghulam Muhammad Bhut is a great loss the resistance movement: Peoples League

Death of Ghulam Muhammad Bhut is a great loss the resistance movement: Peoples League
Acting chairman of Jammu Kashmir Peoples League, Mukhtar Ahmad Waza has expresses profound grief and sorrow over the sad demise of Ghulam Muhammad Bhat, who was suffering from cancer and left heavenly abode on Sunday. A delegation of pro-freedom leaders led by Prof. Abdul Gani Bhat along with Mukhtar Ahmad Waza, Bilal Gani Lone, Mohammad Yasin Malik, Fazl Haq Qurashi visited the house of Bhat and conveyed the condolences to the bereaved family. Later on the delegation paid a visit to martyrs graveyard at Eidgah and offered Fateh Khawani to all martyrs including Shaheed Hurriyat Mirwaiz Moulana Mohammad Farooq, Shaheed Abdul Gani Lone, Shaheed-e-Azeemat Sheikh Abdul Aziz, Shaheed Ishfaq Majeed and Shaheed S. Hameed Wani. The delegation said that they are committed to the oath and carry on the mission for which these martyrs have laid down their precious lives shall be carried till to the logical conclusion.

Who says APHC is irrelevant?

Where red hot blood of youth, ashes of residential houses, more painfully the lost honour ----- be represented by a forum like APHC in Kashmir, no change however big in situation can marginalize such forums or render them irrelevant. Kashmiris are caught up in a dangerously conflicting situation. But look at their political valour, they are facing it manfully. This is like dancing in the mouth of a lion, with such a style not letting to be swallowed by the beast, however, while crying in the process, the cries should be heard and while smiling, the smile should be understood. To smile with derision is never pleasing. The smile with derision conveys what it does---------anger, alienation and turmoil. Therefore, while analyzing the given situation let thinkers in India and Pakistan not falter and not make wrong predictions without taking into consideration the collective Psychological behaviour of the people of Kashmir.” The senior liberation leader and the former Chairman of All Parties Hurriyat Conference, Prof Abdul Ghani Bhat in his exclusive interview with Nisar Ahmed Thakur.How do you see the developments taking place in the region with reference to Kashmir?In view of the turbulent history of the subcontinent one should admit this harsh reality that Kashmir is an internationally recognised dispute that pushed India and Pakistan to wars. Kashmir is a dispute that bedevils relations between the two countries. Kashmir as a consequence of nuclear weaponization of India and Pakistan has assumed monstrous dimensions; it is a nuclear flash point. If we choose to ensure peace in the entire South Asia region we will have to address Kashmir, therefore any development in Kashmir, around Kashmir or about Kashmir will have to be viewed in a perspective, a perspective which is rooted in political history of the subcontinent.Despite the APHC’s call for boycott people in Kashmir participated in the recent Assembly elections. What do you say about it is it that the people have lost their faith in APHC?When I discuss Kashmir with reference to elections I take a position which is that no electoral process whatsoever has any direct or indirect bearing on the future dispensation of the dispute on Jammu and Kashmir. The UN Security Council in this regard adopted a resolution declaring that no electoral process in Kashmir will in any case affect the nature of the dispute as well as the future dispensation.So for as the electoral process is concerned you see anywhere in the world elections are always held with a view to set up an administration to govern the people in order to provide them orderly life. This usually lasts for 5 years and then you repeat the exercise so as to give the people a chance to elect the representatives of their own choice.Whereas to determine future of a region or people, if and when it is disputed, you don’t hold elections, you hold a plebiscite and a plebiscite is organized once the entire life of a nation, unlike the electoral process you don’t need to repeat the exercise after every five years. Therefore, you have to draw a line between elections and a referendum. So let it be clear that plebiscite is organized in a region wherein the peoples’ aspirations are required to be ascertained.Hurriyat in Kashmir stands for a plebiscite not for the elections. Therefore when you discuss Kashmir as a dispute with reference to the electoral process, well I am not upset about any election process, I am not upset by any type of results, I am not upset by any style of the voting by the people be it be brisk or be it just sluggish. I don’t bother my head about it.Electoral process any where in the world has to be viewed with reference to the grievances and the problems of the people. So the governments or local administrations are installed to solve the problems facing the people in any country. However, no government can claim to be the final arbiter of the future of a state, no not at all; the final arbiters are the people. Well in Kashmir the administration is not the final arbiter with reference to future dispensation, it is the people of Kashmir who are the architects of their destiny.Even the voters in Jammu and Kashmir have made it abundantly clear that they vote neither for India nor Pakistan, they vote neither for anybody nor against anybody rather they voted for the problems. They voted just to ensure that their problems and grievances are addressed. So therefore while discussing Kashmir let us not mix-up the future dispensation with electoral process.Hurriyat had taken a position earlier on that elections constitute no issue for us and I explain for obvious reasons as for as the future dispensation is concerned election is not the answer and it has never been the answer. India and Pakistan fought wars in spite of elections; no elections could produce a result with reference to the final settlement of Kashmir. I think we will have to address the root cause in Kashmir, if we really mean to ensure peace, not peace of the graveyard but peace at heart, peace at home, once we choose to do it I am sure that we will be able to ensure a brighter future and a better region for the people in South Asia.In view of the political changes sweeping across the globe what steps do you suggest to make APHC a vibrant political forum?Competence and honesty are the virtues of leadership. Where competence and honesty guides the leadership no hiccups can cause its death, where incompetence and dishonesty be the method of dealing with a particular situation you can visualize the consequences. Yes, the ineptness and the lack of sanity will in every case lead to failures. So for as the APHC as a forum is concerned there needs a lot of thinking, APHC will have to consider different issues no doubt about it, they will have to discuss the situation with reference to India-Pakistan as well as global changes, every thing has to be taken into consideration. The dynamics of the change will have to be taken into consideration let me tell you if we lose sight of the changes sweeping across we may be swept away by the winds of change. We will have to devise a strategy to ride the tide of change; if we don’t do it I am afraid the change may swallow us deep down. So the members of the APHC in Kashmir will have to do a lot of thinking in hammering out a strategy to deal with the challenges ahead. Well failures are the pillars of success. But you only need the courage to admit and then correct your misdeeds. This will ensure success in any circumstances. So it is very important that people shouldn’t now in any case ride a blind horse.What about restructuring of APHC?We have to have a constitution, although we have a constitution no doubt about it, but I feel that we need amendment in the constitution that will enable us to effectively workout a strategy to deal with any situation. If the constitution be somewhat hazy with reference to certain issues, certain pressing issues, we will probably never be able to deal with any situation therefore my first suggestion to APHC would be that the constitution of the APHC is amended to suit the genius of the people as well as address the current issues effectively. Restructuring is the stepping stone rather a launching pad for Hurriyat to restart political life as a whole.As an intellectual what do you think about the institutionalization of Hurriyat?Institutionalization of Hurriyat is an essential part of our collective forum, because we will have to build institutions not only to sustain the movement but also giving people some thing to think about, some thing to live with and something to live for. That is very important and I don’t want to go into the further details………We will have to produce ideas with reference to the solution of Kashmir. We need people who can provide us with ideas to deal with the situation, who can occasionally float some outlines of future solution of Kashmir. We need such institution that is one aspect of it but let it be clear that we don’t need to dismiss Hurriyat as just a bunch of people with no ideas, this is not fair but at the same time it does not mean we are all Platos of our times and none other than us will have the mandate to talk and mandate to deliver.However, we are a forum that represents the peoples’ aspirations. We need to explain to the people elsewhere that this forum represents the ashes of the houses, the last honour of our mothers, sisters and daughters. Where the investment be blood, ashes and the lost honour such political forums can never be marginalized. Whatever the situation they may experience hiccups I confess, they may commit mistakes, they may probably not be able to cope with any situation and they may sometimes fall prey to emotionalism and cause problems to be faced by entire people in the state that is true, I do admit but this is an undeniable fact that the Hurriyat represents the investment that is huge and which in terms of politics can never ever be ignored, impossible…Therefore Hurriyat people will have to proceed not only with constitutional restructuring, institutionalization but also with deeper understanding of the problems facing us as a whole. For that you need think tanks to develop links with Hurriyat and with the people and probably with the future as well if that happens I am sure that we will be able to deliver.Other than the APHC there are some political forces in Kashmir who are talking of a durable and final settlement of Kashmir dispute. What do you think about having relationship with such forces?Well, we will have to have a working relationship with all such political parties in Jammu and Kashmir who by one way or the other seek permanent settlement of Kashmir dispute.Kashmir belongs to all. We will have to move together, the togetherness I talk about will give us not only courage but wisdom too, to build a secure future for the next generation in Kashmir and in South Asia as well. This is how I look at it.As a relevant political forum, how would the APHC prove its strength as cynics in Indian media say that the forum has lost support of the masses in Kashmir?I think Indians falter in analysing any given situation, so also may be probably the case in Pakistan. In certain quarters that they falter and they do not consider Kashmir in a proper historical, political and psychological prospective. If you don’t do it you will never be able to analyze a given situation scientifically and objectively. And in my opinion while discussing Kashmir issue you will have to understand Kashmiris with reference to history.My history as a Kashmiri is chequered, I had to grow under tyranny, I had to bear with oppression but my beauty lies not so much in mountains or the flowing rivers or gardens the Mughals made. No……my beauty lies in bearing the burden of sanity and that is a big thing wherefore I live as a community and I live as Kashmiri, otherwise, look at the people who invaded us, look at them they would have finished us …But we never could be finished this is because we understand the art of living, we know how to bear the burden of sanity. One more important feature of our collective personality is that in a conflicting situation we choose to adjust, this adjustability is unfortunately misconstrued either as normalcy or a surrender both are incorrect.Those who ignore the history of Kashmir and the Kashmiris should bear in mind that people of Kashmir have not given up their cause. I want to remind them just a couple of months back there was just a spark, which engulfed the entire state. The issue of Shrine Board….what happened, it was a department to department issue, a trivial issue but look at it when people got an opportunity they rose, rose as one politically homogeneous unit, they did not demand any thing else but raised a slogan “we want freedom”…this was a ladder which we used to reach the ultimate destination. And let the cynics, wherever they be, appreciate the dynamics of Kashmiris’ political strategy. They strike and strike harder when it gets hot and if they don’t feel, blame shall lie with them.Destination! What do you mean?The destination is permanent settlement of the dispute of Kashmir; it is in the permanent settlement of the dispute of Kashmir that you will not only ensure peace but also purposeful progress, the progress for each region that is again very important. And when Kashmiris say we seek a permanent settlement of the dispute they are at the same time introducing an element of flexibility into it that is there are people in some parts of Jammu and Ladakh who don’t want to go with you, you can not ignore them. So you have to go together, move together and when you talk in terms of Jammu, Ladakh, Kashmir and Azad Kashmir you need a large heart.In your opinion what is the way forward to seek a workable solution of Kashmir dispute?You have to be imaginative and pragmatic you can’t live in a vacuum, impossible, you can’t draw lines on running water, no pictures can come up when you recognize the sombre political realities that yes considering contradictions in Jammu and Kashmir you have to introduce an element of flexibility into your attitudes and your approach towards the problem that will facilitate the resolution of Kashmir problem if that does not happen I am afraid we may land ourselves in a huge trouble and that should be avoided. I think when we say the permanent settlement of Kashmir we mean that we will never ever ignore the people living in the parts of Jammu and Ladakh. Even we can not ignore India and Pakistan at any cost because both the nations are deeply involved in Kashmir.India and Pakistan are two sovereign states, I represent the dispute in Kashmir, I don’t represent the state as such, I am not sovereign, and my sovereignty is in dispute when Kashmir is in dispute, everything is in dispute, the peace of land is in dispute, the grip of India is in dispute. I don’t go into the semantics of words I am talking in terms of the sombre political realities we will therefore have to understand that it is through a dialogue, a purposeful, comprehensive and productive dialogue that we can ensure a brighter tomorrow better region for the generations to come.Considering nuclear weaponization, the open market economy, the Chinese and American involvement in South Asia, considering all this we have to work together with sanity and pragmatism to achieve a breakthrough to resolve the dispute of Kashmir amicably. To seek a settlement, Kashmiris have to be content with two conflicting situations (a) we have to live, if we don’t live we need no freedom, we need freedom for the people who live not for the dead (b) we never ignore the sentiment we never accept the political hegemony, India and Pakistan will have to accept this reality, well for that matter Kashmiris don’t want to ride rough shot on anybody they don’t allow any other to ride rough shot on them that is the principle therefore while addressing in a given situation, the forces operating in the conflicting zone must not misconstrue this adjustability of Kashmiris as normalcy or as an improvement in the situation. This is absolutely wrong, that is why I say while analyzing the Indians falter and probably Pakistanis too in many cases.How can APHC prove its strength on ground as well as on the international level?My strength doesn’t lie in ballot papers; my strength doesn’t lie in holding huge rallies, my strength lies in the sentiment, rooted deep down into the hearts and minds of the people in Kashmir. My strength lies in the realization in Europe and America that unless we address the root cause, we can never fight violence. Well how do we do it? We are proceeding towards what we have been preaching over the years that is the entire world realizes that unless the root in Kashmir is addressed no arrangement can work, no arrangement whether it be between India and Pakistan, whether it be between Pakistan and Kashmiris, between Indians and Kashmiris it is not going to yield any positive results. I know trilateral dialogue is probably not workable at the moment but a trilateral arrangement in any case is workable wherein Kashmiris should be taken into confidence. Unless they do it I am afraid we will not be able to make any headway.This is what is shaping up, shaping up not only in the subcontinent, but elsewhere in the world. You know just a couple of months back, people of Kashmir rose; they rose in such a fashion that produced music in terms of global politics there are the countries who asked India not to use force against peaceful protestors in Kashmir. Even Indian intellectuals came up with statements saying that it is in the interest of India that they free themselves from Kashmir, and Kashmiris free themselves from Indian. This was a huge statement, I don’t think we don’t have to worked hard but the need of the hour is to have a deeper sense of understanding and a lot of rethink on many issues which are probably, occasionally as trivial as any issues but these issues some times cause turmoil in our ranks therefore we have to be wakeful and not blind to. If competence and honesty not be the criteria, no miracles can happen.....Any message for the leadership of India and Pakistan?There has to be imaginative and pragmatic approach in New Delhi as well as in Islamabad towards the people of the subcontinent as a whole. What is that? That is the Indians and Pakistanis declare they are brothers, we are good neighbours, we have problems but we have the capacity to resolve these disputes in the larger interests of the people of the region for that matter you will have to resolve the dispute of Kashmir because Kashmir is the mother of all odds, if the mother is treated, health is restored I am sure that we will absolutely have no illness either in terms of relationship or in terms of our politico-psychological behaviour.

The Rediff Interview/Hurriyat Chairman Professor Abdul Gani Bhat

'In politics, rats marry snakes and bulls chase lizards'
He thrusts. He parries. He ducks. He dodges.
At 64, All-Parties Hurriyat Conference chairman Professor Abdul Gani Bhat is as nimble as a teenager. rediff.com found that out during an exclusive interview earlier this week.
The former professor of Persian, who heads the Muslim Conference, one of the APHC's seven major constituents, is now walking "a path strewn with thorns".
It isn't a fortnight since he escaped an attempt on his life. Under him the separatist forum faces attacks from hardliner colleagues. Trouble within emanates mainly from Jamaat-e-Islami leader Syed Ali Shah Geelani, who minces no words in criticising the Hurriyat's official stand.
In response, Professor Bhat had written to the Jamaat chief, asking him to replace Geelani in the APHC executive council. However, that party, the biggest constituent of the forum, refused.
Such differences, the chairman claims, will have no effect on the APHC. "You must remember it is a forum of parties, not individuals," he said.
He entered politics in 1986, with the Muslim United Front. Two years later, when the Muslim Conference was revived in the valley, he took over as its president. He became the APHC chairman last year.
Excerpts from a discussion with Assistant Editor Chindu Sreedharan wherein Professor Bhat was as cautious as he was rhetorical:
The cease-fire is into its third extension. How would you describe the last three months? Extension or no extension, unless the dispute in Kashmir is addressed no peace can return. Peace cannot happen in vacuum. You can't have both simultaneously, cease-fire and the fire. Therefore, when you discuss cease-fire, particularly a unilateral cease-fire, it has to be understood with reference to the basic issue. Which is, the future dispensation of Jammu and Kashmir.
When the prime minister of India announced the unilateral cease-fire, even then I said a unilateral cease-fire is no cease-fire. That can happen only when you win a war. If you don't win a war and you call a cease-fire it cannot hold.
During the last three months, we have had bloodshed, we have had custodial killings, we have had indiscriminate firings, unjustified crackdowns and humiliating searches... all this and all that. Subjecting people to all sorts of indignities under the cover of a unilateral cease-fire! This is how it was implemented in Kashmir.
Where do you see this truce offer going now?
Well, I am not a pessimist. I can see a ray of hope around. In the people's words, in the people's thoughts, and even, to an extent, in the people's deeds. I see a ray of light across the tunnel too. A ray which we shall have to make grow, a ray which we shall have to preserve, a ray which I know will light up. It will brighten our future.
India, Pakistan and the APHC have absolutely no alternative other than talking. Talking sensibly, talking with a deep sense of responsibility, talking with imagination and, above everything else, talking with boldness and courage. There is no other alternative. Who sees this opportunity first, you or me or they, that person will go down in the annals of history as the first peacemaker in the South-Asian region.
In a recent interview you had said, 'There are saboteurs on all sides'. Could you clarify that statement?
I don't have to. I don't need to. For reasons I needn't explain. There are saboteurs around, and they are so irresponsible that I don't have to locate them [for you]. You know them, I know them, all sensible people know them. There are saboteurs here, there, everywhere.
Does that mean they are within the APHC too?
I don't say APHC, or National Conference, or the Government of India or Pakistan, or any political party. No. But I dare say there are people in India, in Pakistan, in Kashmir, who knows who these saboteurs are.
If I were to say that is an oblique way of saying there are saboteurs in the APHC..?
There can be no saboteurs in the APHC. If there are any, they cannot belong to it. You cannot be a saboteur and a freedom-lover too.
How do you see Prime Minister Atal Bihari Vajpayee's statement on February 24 indicating the APHC visit to Pakistan would be facilitated?
A leap forward in the peace process is the APHC's travel to Pakistan. Therefore, if Mr Vajpayee says we are considering that, he is responding to the writing on the wall, probably hearing the beating of our hearts. Yes, it is a positive move.
The Kashmiris seem to expect an overnight solution to the dispute. As the APHC itself points out, it is a "53-year-old dispute". Is it reasonable to expect a quick solution -- people are disappointed that the cease-fire months haven't brought any dramatic results -- to such a longstanding problem? Russia broke in a day's time. It didn't take years. The Americans grew dramatically rather than methodically.
Yes, Kashmiris understand that this is a different situation. This is not 1971, when you break Pakistan into two. Bangladesh, you teach Pakistan a lesson in Bangladesh, you force Pakistan to break up!
This is not 1998 either. When you carried out an explosion, Pakistanis followed suit. You have the Agnis, you have the Trishuls, they have the Hataps, Shaheens and whatnots. So this maddening arms race in India and Pakistan has to be viewed with realism. If you do not, you will not be able to banish the ghosts of the atomic war in the region. We know you cannot afford a war. India cannot now ask Pakistanis to keep off. Because Pakistan is as powerful as India. You cannot afford to fight a war. But, remember, the hatred between the two countries is so deep-rooted that you cannot rule out a war either.
Therefore, to banish the ghosts of war, we will have to address Kashmir at a faster, faster, faster pace. You talk of months, I may probably choose to do it in weeks. The reason being, I am concerned. Not so much about the future of the people in Jammu and Kashmir, but the future of the people in India and Pakistan. Because if you fight a war, India and Pakistan will suffer now rather than the people of Jammu and Kashmir. It is a different thing now, it is not the 70s. I personally want the dispute to be addressed as quickly as possible. And peace is ensured as permanently as we expect.
You are committed to a plebiscite here. Why don't you do it? Why don't you punish the people who backed out? You made pledges on the soil of Kashmir, you made pledges on the floor of the Indian Parliament, you made pledges to international forums like the United Nations. You said the people of Jammu and Kashmir are the masters of their fate. That they can express themselves through an impartial plebiscite to be organised by the United Nations. Why don't you do it?
A precondition was that Pakistan releases the part of Kashmir under it.
Look, my friend, you are building your case in a vacuum. Unless the UN takes over control of Jammu and Kashmir, neither India nor Pakistan can withdraw. Can they? You tell Pakistan to withdraw! But first things first: The plebiscite administrator was to take over, which he never did. And you still say Pakistanis should withdraw? Why?
If the plebiscite administrator takes over tomorrow and asks Pakistan to withdraw and they don't, yes, of course, Pakistan is to blame. But you are putting the cart before the horse. This is not acceptable.
Will the APHC consider a visit to Pakistan without Mr Geelani?
We have not received any intimation from the Government of India about the passports. We do not know who's getting a passport and who's not. As and when we know that, we will meet and take a decision. It is for the executive council to decide.
There is a view that without Mr Geelani, the rest of the APHC leaders will not be so effective in Pakistan. Please comment. If the impression is that there is only one holy cow, Geelani, let the holy cow only move to Pakistan and get things done. Finished! We are interested in putting the process on the right track. If you do it, I will feel delighted. I am interested in results. I don't agree with that impression, but I will be delighted if the results are there. I consider all the seven members of the executive council as equally important.
What precisely do you hope to achieve in Pakistan? Who all would you be meeting there?
We will talk to the government of Pakistan, exchange views with them. We will talk to the leadership from Azad Kashmir. We will interact, more importantly, with the mujahideen leadership. That is it. We have said that in clear terms.
Reports indicate that some members of the APHC general body feel left out. Are you sure they will support the parleys you have in Pakistan?
I hope and trust that the APHC represents the sentiments of the people, they enjoy the confidence of the people, that they command the respect of the people. The general body too belongs to the people.
One consequence of the cease-fire is that it has brought to the fore differences within the APHC. As chairman, how do you propose to address these?
There are bound to be differences between members of any political party, even [between members] in a household. When you consider a political forum like the APHC, the differences can take on a dimension that may engage the attention of the people. This is true. But the differences are not so material as to lead to a split, horizontal or vertical. Therefore I am not bothered about it. Maybe I feel a little concerned about certain friends making statements, which perhaps could have been avoided. But then, these are issues we will take up in our forthcoming executive council meeting.
As and when all members reach Srinagar, I will call a meeting. We will sit, discuss dispassionately everything concerning Hurriyat Conference. I hope and trust that we, the members of the executive, realises the responsibility he is to shoulder, understands the duty he is to discharge, the duty which he owes to his conscience and the people. Therefore, emotionalism, sentimentalism... are probably things we should avoid."
Who do you think was responsible for the grenade attempt on you? For what purpose?
Well, my person is involved. Therefore I don't want to discuss it.
Pakistan has now come out with a code of conduct for jihadi groups. How would you describe this development?
I have not seen the code of conduct as yet. As soon as I get a copy, I will discuss the whole issue with you if you like. Let me see it first then we will discuss.
Do you agree with Mr Lone's statement in Pakistan that it is time for talks and militants should withdraw to facilitate that?
Well, I don't want to run into any controversy. My job is to dispel doubts if there are any.
At this juncture, since you see a ray of hope, would you ask the militants to respond to the peace offer? As and when we meet the mujahideen in Pakistan, I think we will have to talk straight, straight to their hearts. I hope we will be able to hear their heartbeats. We will reach an understanding, I trust, in about a week's time or so. We will be able to go along with each other. We have to. Because both of us, he who lays his life down and we who fight with arguments, serve the same cause.
But I am afraid if you expect a miracle to happen in a day's time, we may not be able to do it. We may take two days. We may take a week. We may have to undergo another travel. It doesn't matter. What matters is whether you go or not. If you go, your going, simple going, will be a positive development, not only in terms of the political situation obtained, but in terms of your future plan to build a healthy society in the subcontinent.
You sound optimistic about getting them to agree.
I have said what I said. I wish you could understand that the path we are out to pursue is strewn with thorns. The travel we are undertaking is hazardous. We are not on a pilgrimage, we are not on a visit to see historical places, we are not on a visit to see friends, no. We are on a hazardous mission. For god's sake, don't force me to come out as straight as you expect.
Mr Geelani's hardline stand, would you say it is obstructing the peace process?
Well, I don't want to draw lines between what you call hardliners and softliners and extremists and moderates and hawks and doves. Because I have seen with my own eyes doves turning into hawks and hawks becoming doves. In politics, rats marry snakes and bulls chase lizards. Anything can happen in politics. But, remember, the urge for peace is universally accepted as a force of history. You cannot go against it. Nobody can go against it.